I agree with comments that money plays a factor in helping a team succeed. More money, better trainers, better facilities, top of the line tournaments and etc...
If money is the variable than I can assume that teams in NJ without winter facilities will not compete at such events? ....I guess it makes sense. On the topic of points, you have to have some sort of objective measurement in order to categorize success....and as far as financial difficulty for some players, it is sad to see some are left behind. Definitely, a boring, but interesting topic of USA Soccer development.
I agree that you need objective measure--and points might be best way of doing this. I guess problem is that points can be kind of bought. But teams do also get points for league play. so it is possible for teams like Hudson a year or so ago, or DOL more recently, to move up in rankings. But it seems they can only get so far, or only stay up for so long. Not like perennials such as sdfc, stronghold, etc. don't know what better system would be though . . .
Fools. SDFC and other top teams are playing the best if the best. To get any points at all they must win the tournament. To win such a tournament proves how good they really are. DOL and other such teams have a much easier task in gaining points against inferior teams.
DOL is one example of an excellent team that does not travel to any out of state tournaments(except Delco). I think they would be competitive with any higher ranked teams. Didn't some of their players just join SDFC? Probably the players wanted more exposure through national tournaments but is their new team a lot better?
i don't think anyone is trying to argue that sdfc and other top ranked teams are not very very good. the point i hear and that seems to make sense is that there are many talented players and teams that will never get the exposure due primarily to $--and that is something that differentiates youth soccer from youth basketball and football (as well as track--not sure about baseball). maybe one downside of high school soccer not being important/competitive for the most part. the fact that college recruiting is done almost exclusively through the tournament system is a major factor in all of this.
I would like to ask what opinions people on this discussion have of D1 college soccer. I've been watching and have to say that (not to be a jerk, but) I'm really not so impressed. It's not a measurable step up from what I see in U16 now besides the athleticism and speed. Of course it's a step up in certain ways but from what I see, I'm left with the impression that much recruiting is done on basis of physicality/speed rather than intangibles like vision, creativity, and finer technical skills. I haven't seen enough to feel like this impression is exactly right, but what do other people think about this? and how might it relate to this whole discussion about ranking top tier club teams--since presumably this is where a good deal of D1 players are coming from (I know academy players are heavily in the mix too though).
Size my friend. Size. And yes some lower mid level teams have a player or two just not 15 of them
I have watched a few D1 college games. (Rutgers U). What stood out to me right away was the size of the players. In my opinion, the main things college coaches want are size and speed.
Bingo They take size over skill any day
...no matter how we slice this, it seems that size, speed, and athletic ability reigns over vision, creativity and fine technical skills in many coaches eyes. We see this in the national team at the present time. Compare the 1994 national team vs todays national team.College coaches seem to be a just step above high school coaches?
Forget speed. Size is primary
Yes, and we see how size hurt the German team in the world cup. Such generalizations. Wake up. Look at the athletes in any sport (except jockeys) from 20-30 years ago and now. They are all bigger, faster, more athletic. Why wouldn't that be the case for soccer? And there isn't any argument that size is more important than skill - just that size AND skill is preferable over skill and no size or strength. There will always be the Messi, Arguerro, Teves, etc in the sport. But they will become more and more confined to being up forward. Except in the US - for some reason all the players on the U17 through U20 teams are the size of Tab Ramos. Wonder why. LOL.
SSC is consistently mentioned as one of NJ's top teams. Placed last in their bracket. Why such a poor showing at Disney? Lost one of their games 6-0.
Apparently SSC just had a bad outing.
Yes tab knows less than you.
6-0?? SSC care to explain? I am very surprised at this score.
Well it was 5-0 and then the other team scored again. Relax, it happens. They don't owe you an explanation. Kids get down a few goals and their heads drop and boom. Not an SSC person, looking forward to competing with them this Spring.
The level of competition at these events is superb. 40-minutes of soccer (they were 1-0 down at half time) doesn't define where SSC are if you look at their other results from the tournament.Qualification for tournaments like Disney is success in itself and the players will have been seen by college coaches who dont look at the scoreboard.
Couple of bad calls, couple of bad plays and there you have it. If you think it is who we are you will have time to show us soon enough.
Stronghold losing because of bad calls? Anyone not surprised by that?
Totally expected it. Every time SSC has a bad outing there were bad calls made. It is never we did not play well. It is never we were overmatched. It is never we were outplayed.It is always bad calls by the ref against us.
Really? Where do you see that in the past? I don't feel this to be true.
C'mon. Are you serious. You must be new to this forum.
The Champions League groups are out. Why is Marlton in the lowest group?
Lol. The lowest group of the best teams. Put it into perspective
Seem to remember something about a missed handball call against SDFC a month or so ago.....just sayin But seriously, 6-0 games happen sometimes to any teams, SSC will be fine, just had a disappointing tournament.
No, one match. Maybe the best that could have happened as some now believe that they now have a legit shot.
...loosing by many goals does not mean much. Let us say it was a bad day. Remember, last year SDFC lost 7 0 on their first match in Disney. Now, loosing consistently by large score difference could be detrimental.
LAST year SDFC was a much different team. LAST year does not matter. It was a nice rebuttal by SSC however to get the heat off of them.
Champions league? What is that?
what do you mean last year does not matter, you still lost 7-0. It is still a lost by SDFC.
SSC are you a different team now then you were this time last year? Different players? Different growth? If you are, then you know that last year was different and no longer matters.
In 3 months time, all the teams will be different. Same players, but the level of performance will depend on how hard each team is working now. What's happened last year or even last week has no bearing on the results of the spring. It just has an impact on the all so precious rankings.SDFC in recent performances have set themselves away from the pack a little, but there's a lot of teams in Jersey that could beat them on any given day and that's what makes this sport so great.Between SDFC, STA, Match Fit, SSC, Marlboro, SJEB etc there's a lot of great soccer going to be played
Agreed, but one omission. Marlton.
You make a good point, but at this time based on the current SDFC roster you have to admit that this team is more then just a bit away from the pack. The team as set today is stronger and lasts years roster was very strong to begin with.
Would not most teams feel that way? Unless your team lost many players most coaches go into the new season with revived hope. I am glad these teams are having the success they are but lets not go over the top.
Staying humble is not something that comes easy but everyone should try to keep their feet on the ground. No team is perfect.
Correct that no team is perfect but show me a weak spot on SDFC. That is the reason for the recent success. Really a well put together group.
So are you saying their perfect?Bravo!!! They will not lose a single game all season. Give us a break! They're only a human team, not a supernatural one.
What part of "no team is perfect" would make you think I was saying they are perfect?
Can't show you a weak spot now but maybe after the season. They are very good and off to a great start but let's see what happens after games are played.
SSC will be just fine.. For the record SSC did not have its full team at disney. They were missimg 4 starters.. They had 2 very competitive games and and a 3rd game that was 1-0 at half time..Good luck in the spring season to all NJ teams...
SSC always missing starters when they lose
For the record I just did research in the Disney tournament because of all the nasty post about SSC and SDFC. 16 year old boys can have great tournaments and bad ones. If you take the time to look up the ranking in both flights. SSC was in a much much tougher bracket based on got soccer points. SDFC had a fairly easy bracket with the exception of Louden that was also missing 4-5 starters. Regardless it a tournament and in the past.
Another thing. Seriously SDFC you guys are very ignorent. None of your players have college commitments yet. So get off your self proclaimed horse and let the kids have fun playing. Having major points or winning tournaments don't amount to anything but memories. So be a good parents and let the boys be boys
Defending both SDFC and SSC but clearly from SSC. How would anyone know how many starters were missing. Are you seriously stating that the SDFC schedule was not top notch. Get a life SSC and grow up
How do you know who is going anywhere? What makes you so all knowing on all things SDFC/SSC?
Will you tools shut up. Do you have any idea what idiots you sound like? you both must be 12 year olds.
It is a stupid conversation, but why is Stronghold taking the approach they are? My guess is that Stronghold feels they are as good if not better and SDFC has the resume to show otherwise. Reality is they are both excellent teams and stand above.
One team won and another lost, it happens everyday. There are a lot of good teams in NJ besides SDFC and SSC, but not everyone lives in Montclair, Glen Ridge, Bernardsville and Bedminster and can afford the best trainers and tournaments. You guys have put together good teams, but put some other teams under these circumstances and I am sure they can accomplish the same.
You don't PAY for playing in top tournaments you EARN the right to be in them by winning. Every team has that opportunity. Take a look at the player makeup of these two teams and you will find players coming from many towns that you would not consider wealthy. Enough of the excuses, give credit.
Top tournaments are free? It's a business. Travel to and from tournaments is also a big expense. The boys miss days of school and parents take off work to go with them. My son's team is very good and they love playing and there's plenty of good competition right here. If you want to think only the best teams go to big tournaments, go right ahead but I don't agree.
4:53, you contradict yourself. You go to big tournaments yet there is plenty of good competition here. What are you saying?
You're all forgetting that teams at this age group are now competing to showcase. The college coaches go to the big events, so kids who have ambitions of playing in college need to play in front of the coaches. Winning helps get the attention of the schools, but performances will get players recruited.Soccer is a business in this country and that is unfortunate but it also provides opportunities for playing and life experiences. We have all chosen soccer for our boys so they can develop life skills and character through sport. And if it helps them get into the right college then that's even better. If you have questions or concerns about what all the clubs are doing and why, whether it be SDFC, Stronghold, Match Fit or STA then email the respective coaches. You'll get more sense than the name calling and stirring that entertains us on our coffee breaks.
Just asking for the person who claims SSC did not have all of their starters there. So you are telling me that SSC went to one of the premier events in terms of college recruiting and multiple players chose to skip it? What could have been more important for a 16yr old very serious soccer player to do? Seems a bit nutty after all of the efforts they and their parents are putting in to play soccer at this level...
According to the above report it was "4" "starters".
Stronghold plays the, we had players that couldnt come card, but they do it on purpose. It allows them to bring guest players, the ones they really would like to have, to all of the important tournaments.
Those guest players didn't help them anyway. LOL!!!
I'm affiliated with a PA team that has played SDFC multiple times in the last calendar year. Watch SDFC right now and then comment please. I watched them play Loudoun at Disney and they controlled the entire game. Loudoun was not missing anyone, but had a key player nursing an injury. SDFC was very good last year, but are on a different level right now. Tons of talent and very organized. They are already qualified for Nationals and have 6 months to prepare! The idea that any of those NJ teams mentioned above are on the same level is ludicrous. BTW - one draw or loss does not refute my argument... this is soccer and upsets do happen, especially when you are already post season bound. When your team qualifies for Nationals, you should respond. Otherwise... compete for 2nd in NJ.
BS. You happened to watch a game and you know who louden had and didn't have? How is that possible stalker? You asked if they had all their players? I don't know if SDFC us better or worse because I have not seen them play but everyone is playing for first at this point As a matter of fact as strange as it may sound everyone is still chasing the team that won the championship last year and that is Marlboro who won both. Will they repeat or will SSC win? SDFC? Etc? No one knows so keep your false statements and lies to yourself
A team that's well organized and well coached has a huge advantage in competition. This is more important than the individual skills of players. I have seen many teams that get a new coach and suddenly can't win a game. Maybe SDFC has a really good coach.
My son used to play at TSF and coaches would leave. Suddenly, the winning teams that they coached weren't winning as much. SDFC has had the same coach for a long time. It means a lot.
Look at all the top teams. They all have coaching longevity. They also attract the better players from other teams. Seems to me that players can make the coach and coaches can make the players
2:13. TSF was never a top team or even a blip on the radar. Coaches and players left because they new it.
I know. That's why we left along with other reasons. My son had 6 coaches in 1 yr. and that team just went from bad to worse.
ludicrous is the word you used to describe other teams and their ability to be on the same level as SDFC. Ludicrous is really what you mean? No one considers Holmdel a top team any more yet I cant tell you the last time that Holmdel has been beaten by SDFC. Many friendlies have been played and yet no SDFC victories.
Cedar Stars #8 in NJ. With MF and Cedar Stars in the mix this year maybe some of the so called top teams will be exposed.
Cedar Stars got 3000 pts. from playing super-y. That's funny when you consider the best teams don't play super-y. Not an accurate ranking of their team but we'll see what they do in the spring.
Who is Cedar Stars? Where did they come from?
Cedar Stars is a new academy that is out of Bergen County but they also have a Newark club with a St. Benedict's Prep. affiliation. I think this team is Cedar Stars Newark. They're ranked very high for a new team.
Someone brought up Holmdel. I just looked, they are ranked fairly high.
My son used to play for Holmdel/NJX and we stay in touch with some. As we all know they did lose players years ago but they have rebuilt and retooled. They have high hopes for the group they now have.
Did Cedar Stars have a team that played super y at this age group? As far as I know, they did not.
Maybe it was a mistake and they are U15 or U17. Gotsoccer does that sometimes.
I think you're right. Cedar Stars does have multiple teams playing super y but I don't think they played at this age group.
The team exists, academy years are different.
Cedar Stars Newark is not academy. They play EDP.
How is that not an academy and where do they play EDP. Good press for them.
Cedar Stars has academy teams and club teams,just like PDA and HJCSA.Cedars Stars Newark is a new club team made up of St. Benedist Prep kids and they are going to play in EDP.
They have 18 St Benedict players that are age appropriate. I think not.
Early rankings for the spring season? top ten or five?
pretty sure cedar stars combined with NJSA - and perhaps the NJSA team is now the one called Cedar Stars in U16 - I know NJSA played Super Y.
1:43Cedar Stars owns NJCSA but the teams have not combined.CSA Bergen- U8-U14 U14 Academy U13 Pre-Academy and EDPCSA Newark- U8-U18 EDPNJCSA- U8-U18 U14/U16/U18 Academy U12/U13/U15/U18 Pre-Academy and EDP.
Ramos and NJSA04 Academy tried to move to NJ Stallions a few years ago. Didn't work out. Now they're at Cedar Stars. Will see how it goes.
Top 51. SSC2. SDFC3. Matchfit 4. Marlboro5. Marlton
Don't lose sight of STA.
Why Matchfit? They were ranked low last year.
Matchfit is an academy team that is no longer playing academy. Ranked where? They are good
we'll expect great things from matchfit. If you're that good, why wouldn't you be #1? And you are ranked on got soccer.
Academy is different.
Actually this is good that MF is playing the likes of SSC and SDFC. We will see the academy team vs the club team debate carry on.
Earth to Holmdel: Hope is not a strategy. High marks for hanging around but still a daddy ball team.
Why do you care what happens to Holmdel? How do you know the inner workings and who is training? Show me another team that was dominant, had complete turnover and is again a top team. That is not hope, that is a fact.
This Holmdel team was dominant? When?
I guess 2:44 cant read.
Holmdel may be dominant player low-mid level teams but will have a tough time with the top tier.
When will holmdel even play the top teams? Their schedule is against the 2nd tier
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