I am sure that every college coach has his own methods for recruitment but it seems narrow minded for anyone to assume that the best players are in the higher fights at Richmond. It's a top tournament with all quality teams. Players choose teams for many reasons, cost,distance from home, travel requirements, playing with friends, likability and philosophy of coach and club. As far as rankings go, I don't think they're an absolute judge on quality of a team, they're more of a probable quality. It seems to me that there are ways to gain extra pts. by playing extra games and tournaments and all tournaments don't offer the same number of points. Also, it's typical to bring guest players to tournaments to help your team win .
I would agree that there can be very good players at all levels of a tournament like the Jefferson Cup. But to dismiss the idea that the overall quality of the players improves as the flight level does as "narrow minded" seems rather delusional to me.Rankings clearly have flaws. But, for the most part, at this age they provide a reasonable guide for tournament organizers to form competitive flights that don't include many 7-0 matches. And when lopsided results do happen, it's rarely in the top flights. A perfect guide? No. A reasonable one? Yes.Of course, there are a number of different levels of competition in college as well. So maybe they should knock off calling these flights "Championship" and "Elite" and whatever and just start calling them D1, D2, D3 and NAIA.Okay, I'm kidding about that but let's be serious. The teams in the top flight at the Jefferson Cup would drub the teams in the 5th flight with no doubt (except maybe MF Blue?)
And one other thought about guest players.Understanding that my son's (and his teammates') goals at this point are to play well in front of coaches they want to impress at showcases like the Jefferson Cup, I'd be one ticked off paying customer if a "guest" were to be given time on the field with his team at this point. That was cute when these boys were young and winning was all that mattered. But the only reason I could stomach a guest at this point would be a short squad that desperately needs a body.
reasonable, probable. Is there a difference? It is fact that it is common to see a team awarded an extra 100, 200 300 or more pts. for beating higher ranked teams. If someone believes a player to be a superior player based on his team's ranking, maybe that's a little delusional.
I think this is devolving into a dumb argument (from one side).If you were a college coach and your were told you could recruit from only one of the flights at this tournament, which one would you pick?I think that answer to that would differ depending on the level of competition the coach's school plays at. But I'm pretty sure I know which flight would be the choice of a coach from a top 25 D1 school. And I think you do too.
Yeah, I agree that this argument is losing its point. College coaches definitely would like to spend most of their time at the highest flights of a tournament, seeing the best teams. The players on these teams are for the most part, better than players on lower-ranked teams, I think we can agree with that. Of course not all players, but the majority of good players will be on better teams. Does a player have to be on a great team to get recruited? Of course not. Does it help and get the player some more exposure? Obviously. However, there will be plenty of coaches looking at lower flights as well, to pass their time if nothing else.
"College coaches definitely would like to spend most of their time at the highest flights of a tournament, seeing the best teams. The players on these teams are for the most part, better than players on lower-ranked teams, I think we can agree with that."Sorry if this turns out to be a duplicate post as I thought I'd already replied to this quote. But it seems to has disappeared. Anyway, thanks for summing this up so clearly and concisely.Which brings us back here..."Regardless...the real prize being the attention of a coach or two you want to impress. And as that's probably easier to accomplish in the higher flights, MF Black, EB and TSF already look to be the Jersey winners here."So there's really no good argument to the contrary of this.
Sounds like more TSF propaganda to convince all the parents to join them!
Another change in EDP leagues as Ironbound is out of 2nd Div Central and seemingly out of EDP altogether
Has Ironbound really been in this age group of late? A great club with a long history for sure. But I can't say I've seen a decent team from them in this age group for years. My guess is that the kids from Newark somehow migrated to Den of Lions, right?
"Sounds like more TSF propaganda..."Couldn't be MF or EB "propaganda" just as easily?Take it anyway you want. But the message isn't going to change unless the Jeff Cup changes the flights.
I know how arrogant TSF is so this sounds like them for sure!
Yes some ironbound kids did migrate to Den of Lions but recently alot of players from DOL migrated to CSA
Can't say I've caught a lot of TSF arrogance over the years. I mean, really, what could they possibly be arrogant about? They've been also-rans in this age group for as long as I can remember.
You're absolutely right in that they have nothing to be arrogant about but comparing their players to world cup players is one example of their arrogance. And how about declaring themselves winners of a college showcase because they're in a higher flight.sh
The schedule for Jeff Cup and who each team is playing has been posted
"And how about declaring themselves winners of a college showcase because they're in a higher flight."That wasn't anyone from TSF. It was me.And along with MF and EB, the are the NJ winners at the Jeff Cup because they were placed higher than other NJ teams which is what really matters at this point.Jumping to wrong conclusions about anonymous posts is a bad practice on boards like these.
It's interesting that the Jeff Cup doesn't break the 12 teams in each flight down into groups of 4 for the purpose of standings. I guess the team with the most points and best goal differential amongst all 12 in each flight will be awarded the "championship?" But that seems pretty random as there are really 3 groups of 4 in the Elite and Superior flights who will each face completely different competition. And the Platinum flight is even weirder with no clearly defined groups (Ex: Gottschee and Mt. Olive play two of the same opponents but a different 3rd opponent as they don't play each other?)Anyway, here are the NJ teams' opponents...ELITE:MF BLACK/Calverton(MD)/Storm SA(GA)/Pleasant Valley(NYE)EB/Piedmont Triad(NC)/Carolina Elite(SC)/Coral Gables(FL)TSF/Lyons Township(IL)/Lockport(NYW)/BRYC(VA)SUPERIOR:NJ FORCE/CASL Red(NC)/VA Legacy(VA)/Pachuca(MD)PARSIPPANY/Olney Rangers(MD)/Lake Norman(NC)/FC Fredrick(MD)PLATINUM:GOTTSCHEE/Boston Bolts(MA)/World Class(NYE)/Springfield(VA)MT OLIVE/Springfield(VA/Boston Bolts(MA)/Albertson(NYE)CLASSIC:FC COPA/FC Stars(MA)/Penn Fusion Predators(PAE)/VA Rush(VA)MF BLUE/Madison 56ers(WI?)/VA Rush(VA)/WCWAA Black(NC)Good luck to all the NJ teams!
It's a showcase, so typically the 12-team brackets are divided into three 4-team groups. At that stage, the groups are independent of one another, so you are only competing against the 3 other teams in your subgroup.For GotSoccer purposes (apparently a big thing in the Northeast), the top finisher of each group of four will receive championship points minus an adjustment of roughly 10%. This is to compensate for the fact that no semifinals or finals take place. Keep in mind that only the top finisher receives points, so if two teams finish 2-0-1 with a tie in their game against one another, the one with the bigger goal differential gets the points, and the other team goes home empty.When the brackets/subgroups don't fit into this neat little mold, it is common to have 3-team divisions crossover to play other 3-team divisions. This way, even though the teams may not face one another, they will all have common opponents to measure their success against.
Thanks for the info on the points. And yes, they remain a big deal here in the Northeast (at least) as they play a clear role in determining flighting for these showcase tournaments.
Actually, I was making an assumption about the subgroups based on how I've seen it done most often, but I believe I was wrong. Since the Jefferson standings are calculated using 6 points for a win, 3 points for a tie, and points for goals scored and shutouts, they will probably be in groups of 12 as shown with the champion, finalist and semifinalists determined by total points.I've never been a fan of this format. I remember seeing one huge showcase with 30+ teams all in one group. At least 5 teams went 3-0...so you could go undefeated and still wind up being a semifinalist or even a quarterfinalist. Not fair unless the groupings were very evenly balanced. You could do really well against a couple of very strong teams and not get rewarded for it because an improperly seeded team rolls over 3 cupcakes.
Brackets not out yet but what about Manhattan kick off classic. Could be exciting this year if it doesn't get cancelled.
Cedar Stars Newark has a strong team.One of the teams to look out for this season.
New players at Cedar Stars Newark? Or are you seeing a big improvement from the team that's been in place there?
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